I think you both are saying the same thing. It is important to distinguish between patient population and drug indication.

Patient population: I think we would all agree that the diabetic CKD population in BETonMACE experienced a much greater benefit for MACE reduction than the general BETonMACE diabetes population. So, CKD population responds better than normal kidney function population for MACE reduction (cardio indication). But there is also the SGLT2 and DPP4 inhibitor synergy with apabetalone in BETonMACE that establishes additional cardio indication populations.

Drug indication: So far we have only seen MACE data and cognition data for BETonMACE. We have not seen renal/kidney function data yet for the BETonMACE CKD population. We have only seen eGFR data for the total population. Until data comes out showing that apabetalone improves kidney function in the CKD population, then there is no reason to expect a BTD for renal/kidney indication. Data disclosed this far clearly supports cardio indication. Nothing disclosed from BETonMACE to support renal indication yet.

The CKD population may benefit from 2 indications: cardio risk reduction and renal function improvement. But the potential data for latter has not been disclosed yet.

BDAZ